New law governing trout planting and management

[Marv]

Another thing, anything genetic is only created to hurt us, and keep us subservient to the system. In other countries that Amercia "helps" we give the seed with suicide genes. Meaning that you can buy the geneticly engineered seeds and it will only produce one crop. If you plant the seed from the fruit they will not germinate. Why does this even need to exist, only to generate profits.

[Marv]

Largemouth bass, smallmouth, striped bass, all types of catfish, rainbow trout, brown trout, brook trout, bluegill, crappie, carp ARE ALL NON-NATIVE FISH.

If we went back only native CA. strains we could only fish for a couple species of trout in remote areas and Sacramento perch. That would suck. I would love to have snakeheads, muskie, Pike, walleye here.

[borntoscout]

A couple more lashes on a dead horse. Less fishing opportunity seems to be in store for California:

1. SB 1148 in original form contained additional funding to cover some of it's costs. The author and supporters of this bill had to know it would not pass the gov's veto and was only included to allow the bill to be sugar coated. So what is going to be cut?

2. Here is a cautionary note from Utah fisheries researchers concerning the switch to all triploid trout plants for put and grow fisheries as now generally required in California:

Triploid trout can and do perform similarly to diploid trout in certain situations. However, survivability may be cause for concern and mortality of triploids could be exaggerated under less than desirable conditions. If Utah discontinues the production of diploid trout and mandates all rainbow trout stocked be triploids, then reduced survival in general and even total year-class failure can be expected in some situations. More inconsistent survival of stocked trout will likely occur at many reservoirs that have had consistently good sport fisheries. In addition, variable environmental conditions associated with reservoir management in Utah may make setting standard stocking quotas extremely difficult.
The practice of stocking sterile or triploid trout in conjunction with native
fish programs is still a viable management option in some instances. Many
native trout waters in Utah are located at higher elevations and are relatively isolated from many stocked waters. Thus managers could continue to protect native species by careful selection of where triploid and diploid trout are scheduled for stocking.
Conversion from traditional stocking practices of utilizing only diploid trout
to stocking only triploid trout should proceed with caution, especially in waters with marginal habitat conditions. Changes to ‘triploid-only stocking’ could impact traditional sport fisheries and may require an unrealistic demand on hatchery resources. Blanket policies of “one size fits all” or “all rainbow trout stocked in Utah will be triploids” is not necessarily the best management strategy.
Managers should evaluate individual waters based on: 1) threats to native
species, 2) habitat conditions, 3) fishing pressure, and 4) spawning/reproduction potential and balance these considerations to best utilize both diploid and triploid trout to improve sport fisheries and better protect native fish. In some situations, native fish or sterile hybrids such as tiger trout (Salmo trutta X Salvelinus fontinalis) could be substituted in sport fish management when necessary; however, hatchery production must be improved to use these resources at a larger scale.
It should be noted that as of January 2009 the Utah Division of Wildlife
Resources has not discontinued the use of diploid rainbow trout and is in the
process of evaluating and changing current policy as it relates to triploid trout.

The complete study can be read here:

http://utah.ptfs.com/awweb/awarchive...ile&item=21256

[isdaann]

Remember the Delta, and where we are now. man can't manage ****eeee!

[BIG_ONE]

The triploids (i.e. Frankenfish) are sterile. The way they get so big is that the eggs are heated to a certain point during development creating a sterile fish. Since most of a fish's energy is consumed by reproduction, the fish can now grow to enormous proportions.
So triploids cannot reproduce. What I think the previous poster quoted was that the individual quoted is worried about a potential perceived social change in fishermen now being only satisfied with fishing for large fish.
The fallacy of this argument is that all fishermen, since the inception of sport fishing, have sought the big catch. This is nothing new.
I too would like to see the reintroduction of native stock but not if it means less access to trout fishing overall.

I've caught native rainbow and brown that are stocked by DFG...they're just not stocked too often. One reason is because if you genetically breed these wild fish and stock them, they will soon be infertile just like these DFG planters rainbows. These DFG planter rainbows was once wild rainbows. Unlike mammals genetic, fish genetic are entirely weak and prone to quickness in infertility. These DFG planters probably will be able to reproduce within their own. But the ratio of surviving frys between a DFG planters x DFG Planters and a DFG Planters x Wild Native is a great difference. I don't want to start putting numbers and what not to try and sound like a scientist dealing with genetics in a laboratory. But I do my fare share of study and experiment in fish genetics in general. The only slight difference is, some species are cold water and some are warm water. But they all share just about the same concept in terms of fertility and infertility.

[pdgs]

I have yet to read about a single fishery where triploids grow larger than 2N fish "in the wild". Usually they lose out when in competiton with normal trout.

http://www.rmpc.org/files/nwfcc/2009...009_Koenig.pdf

Other studies have shown poor performance of triploid plants in put and grow fisheries.

+1 Agree with the Caveat that independent studies are not readily available. Published studies are commonly done under grant and may or may not be influenced by outside sources. I have seen a number of studies that appear to leave out critical facts in favor of producing a product that influences the end goal of the reporting entity. If a truly independent study is done they are often not considered factual and discarded until brought in as evidence in a court of law. The trick is to try to sort out the slight of hand reports from those that are truly unbiased.

[borntoscout]

I have yet to read about a single fishery where triploids grow larger than 2N fish "in the wild". Usually they lose out when in competiton with normal trout.

http://www.rmpc.org/files/nwfcc/2009...009_Koenig.pdf

Other studies have shown poor performance of triploid plants in put and grow fisheries.

[Rhixso]

In my recent studies in Natural Resources/Parks and Recreation, hybrid trout are more than likely infertile.

The triploids (i.e. Frankenfish) are sterile. The way they get so big is that the eggs are heated to a certain point during development creating a sterile fish. Since most of a fish's energy is consumed by reproduction, the fish can now grow to enormous proportions.
So triploids cannot reproduce. What I think the previous poster quoted was that the individual quoted is worried about a potential perceived social change in fishermen now being only satisfied with fishing for large fish.
The fallacy of this argument is that all fishermen, since the inception of sport fishing, have sought the big catch. This is nothing new.
I too would like to see the reintroduction of native stock but not if it means less access to trout fishing overall.

[Reel Fun]

The white man is a " non native" species......whats next???


RF

[BIG_ONE]

In my recent studies in Natural Resources/Parks and Recreation, hybrid trout are more than likely infertile. Hmm...I don't see how this would make a big effect to the wild native population. I only see it as a $$$ generator at this point until further facts to be proven behind guys with bright white coat, gloves, and large frog eye like goggles in a bright white room. Brown, Brown, Brown...can't wait for the next election for CA.